EMRFD Message Archive 7856
Message Date From Subject 7856 2012-10-12 11:51:08 Nick Tsakonas Some advice on used HP instrument.
My bench has at the time some of the basic instruments, a multimeter, a 50Mhz oscilloscope, a Ghz frequency counter, some signal generators and some other mini test circuits.I mostly experiment on the HF region with receivers , qrp transceivers, mixers, PLLs, oscillators, amps etc.
My multimeter , although a cheap one, has served me for over a decade but now it seems to have a strong will to die. I am now looking for a new bench multimeter and I came across a used HP 3466A on ebay in very good condition and at a price of around 200 USD. The instrument comes without test leads and there is no info on whether it has been ever calibrated.
I have no experience on this kind of instruments (they are what I consider lab-grade) so I would like to ask whether it is wise to buy something like this or look at something else (newer and non-hp I mean). Most of the opinions I found online say "if you find one cheap , grab it" , some other say "the capabilities of those instruments have been surpassed even by the cheapest meters of today"....I would like to ask, is it really a better choice than newer meters (like e.g.UT803 UNI-T or similar in that class.)? is it similar ?or even not comparable? ... the specs of HP 3466A are fine for my needs btw.
Do you know whether it can accept the commonly available test leads or requires some HP-specific set? Do you think that a similar accuracy and measurement quality can be provided by any 150-200 $ modern meter ? Is the calibration something that can be performed easily with common test equipment?
thanks and 73,
Nick, sv1djg
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]7857 2012-10-12 13:49:08 Kerry Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
It works well but I haven't used it for a long time; I have a Fluke 73 and a Fluke 77, each in a holster, and use one or both of those on the bench.
I keep the 73 above the bench using the stand on the holster as you can see here;
http://i49.tinypic.com/vg0dfo.jpg
The 3466 was, and is, a good meter but, as you have been told, modern meters are as accurate. The display on the 3465 is fairly small; it used the old "dots" kind of LEDs. It's quite readable though.
The input terminals take a standard banana plug as used on test leads.
I would not pay $200 for one; I would get a Fluke which can be bought new for less, eg
http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Fluke-77-IV-Digital-Multimeter-/140861367742?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20cbfde5be
If you prefer a bench multimeter there are quite a few to choose from at less than $200. The really cheap ones have rather tacky cases that I don't like much but there are ones like this;
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Digital-Multimeter-Mastech-M9803R-Bench-type-True-RMS-Multimeter-with-RS232-PC-/140840288706?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20cabc41c2
that look OK.
I like the old test gear and have a lot of HP, Boonton etc but I've removed most of it from my bench in favour of newer equipment; I still get-out my HP3455A, though, when I want 6 1/2 - digit precision!
Now THAT is a multimeter! :)
Kerry VK2TIL.7858 2012-10-12 19:31:49 Russ Ramirez Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
own a Fluke 8840, an HP 3478, and others including several Keithley units.
I am not a collector, but have restored, repair and/or calibrated these
units and sell these on eBay when the prices are up - as there is a market
there. Price/value is subjective, but I paid no where near $200 for my
3466A. On the other-hand, one might pay $600 for a HP 34410 and feel they
got a good value. I would advise that if you go the eBay route, to make
sure the seller has a 99+% satisfaction, or 100% if they have not sold very
much. I also personally feel that all three of the aforementioned companies
make such good equipment that buying one used is really not an issue.
Russ
K0WFS
7859 2012-10-12 19:31:49 rlramirez77 Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
The test leads for Fluke will work if the collars are removed, i.e. converted to standard banana plugs, or if the leads are standard (not Fluke) they will work fine. I recommend the leads you see7860 2012-10-12 19:31:49 Ronald RiemVis Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/170642113428
Greetings,
Ronald
On 13 October 2012 02:51, Nick Tsakonas <magicnickus@yahoo.com> wrote:
> **
>
>
> Hello to the group,
>
> My bench has at the time some of the basic instruments, a multimeter, a
> 50Mhz oscilloscope, a Ghz frequency counter, some signal generators and
> some other mini test circuits.I mostly experiment on the HF region with
> receivers , qrp transceivers, mixers, PLLs, oscillators, amps etc.
>
> My multimeter , although a cheap one, has served me for over a decade but
> now it seems to have a strong will to die. I am now looking for a new bench
> multimeter and I came across a used HP 3466A on ebay in very good condition
> and at a price of around 200 USD. The instrument comes without test leads
> and there is no info on whether it has been ever calibrated.
>
> I have no experience on this kind of instruments (they are what I consider
> lab-grade) so I would like to ask whether it is wise to buy something like
> this or look at something else (newer and non-hp I mean). Most of the
> opinions I found online say "if you find one cheap , grab it" , some other
> say "the capabilities of those instruments have been surpassed even by the
> cheapest meters of today"....I would like to ask, is it really a better
> choice than newer meters (like e.g.UT803 UNI-T or similar in that class.)?
> is it similar ?or even not comparable? ... the specs of HP 3466A are fine
> for my needs btw.
>
> Do you know whether it can accept the commonly available test leads or
> requires some HP-specific set? Do you think that a similar accuracy and
> measurement quality can be provided by any 150-200 $ modern meter ? Is the
> calibration something that can be performed easily with common test
> equipment?
>
> thanks and 73,
> Nick, sv1djg
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]7861 2012-10-12 19:31:49 Ronald RiemVis Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
My opinion is as follow:
I bought several HP instruments from Ebay.
My experiences are quite well but you need to read the information from the
seller very well before buy.
I have now a Spectrum analyzer HP8569B and HP4342A Q-factor meter
Both are one's calibrated.
For the Spectrum analyzer I can say even old he still is within all specs,
for the Q-meter I have no way to test the calibration but I also think he
is well within specs.
If you can make the test leads yourself or buy a standard set in a shop I
would buy that multimeter and have fun with it.
Greetings,
Ronald
On 13 October 2012 02:51, Nick Tsakonas <magicnickus@yahoo.com> wrote:
> **
>
>
> Hello to the group,
>
> My bench has at the time some of the basic instruments, a multimeter, a
> 50Mhz oscilloscope, a Ghz frequency counter, some signal generators and
> some other mini test circuits.I mostly experiment on the HF region with
> receivers , qrp transceivers, mixers, PLLs, oscillators, amps etc.
>
> My multimeter , although a cheap one, has served me for over a decade but
> now it seems to have a strong will to die. I am now looking for a new bench
> multimeter and I came across a used HP 3466A on ebay in very good condition
> and at a price of around 200 USD. The instrument comes without test leads
> and there is no info on whether it has been ever calibrated.
>
> I have no experience on this kind of instruments (they are what I consider
> lab-grade) so I would like to ask whether it is wise to buy something like
> this or look at something else (newer and non-hp I mean). Most of the
> opinions I found online say "if you find one cheap , grab it" , some other
> say "the capabilities of those instruments have been surpassed even by the
> cheapest meters of today"....I would like to ask, is it really a better
> choice than newer meters (like e.g.UT803 UNI-T or similar in that class.)?
> is it similar ?or even not comparable? ... the specs of HP 3466A are fine
> for my needs btw.
>
> Do you know whether it can accept the commonly available test leads or
> requires some HP-specific set? Do you think that a similar accuracy and
> measurement quality can be provided by any 150-200 $ modern meter ? Is the
> calibration something that can be performed easily with common test
> equipment?
>
> thanks and 73,
> Nick, sv1djg
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]7862 2012-10-13 07:02:10 Nick Tsakonas Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
the reason I thought about a used HP is because I would like a precision and trusted meter and stay away from el-cheapo meters. I would like a Fluke but it is way out my reach... Kerry,VK2TIL, sent a link for a fluke 77-IV on ebay.com for only 149 USD. The same instrument on ebay.co.uk is listed for an average of 300 UK pounds (that is 510 USD). In Greece Fluke is even more expensive,the cheapest I can find is the T115 for 300 USD.
I think I will pass on this used HP for the moment...however, I will keep my eyes open for other used meters or Fluke's in case I find something affordable.
Thanks,
73, Nick,sv1djg
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]7863 2012-10-13 14:32:23 Kerry Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
I don't understand your comment about Flukes on ebay.uk for 300 pounds; I see several there for 30 or 50 pounds. Is it your exchange rate that's the problem?
US$149 is about 40,000 drachmas.
It's difficult to get good used test gear here in Australia; there's just very little of it compared to the large quantities in the US and, to a lesser extent, in the UK.
Our exchange rate is and has been very good but freight from overseas on heavy items like old HP gear is prohibitive.
I didn't want to sound as if I'm denigrating the 3466; I love the old HP gear and have quite a lot, eg two 141T spectrum analyzer systems with several plug-ins, an 8444A TG, a 180/8558B SA, a 410C, a 411A, a 415E, a 432A, a 536A, an 805A, a 3455A, a 3465A, a 5345A, a 7034A, an 8405A and an 8657B (that will give you some research :) ) plus several smaller items.
Most of it is now "retired"; it takes up a lot of bench/shelf space.
But I occasionally get one of them out if required; only yesterday I wanted to check some RF voltages so the 411A came in from the store-room. It would be nearly 60 years old but it's still accurate; while it was on the bench I lubricated the scratchy zero pot and the jumpy range switch and cleaned the contacts of the power-on light which wasn't working.
I was interested to find that the power-on globe is the same as the four globes used in the optical "chopper" of this instrument; all these globes are still working and I'm sure they would be the original ones.
You know, I might even bring in the 3465A and use it on the bench! :)
Kerry VK2TIL.7864 2012-10-13 17:35:19 Nick Tsakonas Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
>>pounds. Is it your exchange rate that's the problem?
The comment came from the fact that some items within EU are sold at a much higher price.not only on ebay.
Amazon is the same too, Kindle sells for 69 USD on the .com site and 69UK pounds on the .co.uk. with today's rate 69 GPB is 120 USD. Inrad filters...in the US, the models for my TS-850 cost 130USD and 170USD and in European stores they cost - guess what!- 130 Euro and 170Euro. that is 168 and 220 USD respectively...the list can go on...
Most items listed on ebay.com are located in US or outside European Union. In order to avoid custom fees (which on average add an extra 100-150% of the original price) I usually find items on ebay.co.uk or ebay.de where most of the items are located within EU. Most of the times, the same item is much more expensive in the ebay.co.uk or ebay.de sites than the ebay.com site when listed as a BUY NOW item.
See the difference on the link below for FLUKE-77IV within and outside EU.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=fluke+77-iv&_sacat=0&_odkw=fluke+77iv&_osacat=0&_from=R40
if the seller gives the option to bid, then yes, there are some listings starting from 30-50 pounds, but believe me,they do not stay that low!.
As a homework I will check the instruments you have and tell you the total price on ebay.co.uk! :-)
73, Nick,sv1djg
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]7865 2012-10-13 18:04:51 Kerry Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
We read & hear about Greece's economic woes but it doesn't become "real" to us until someone affected, like you, tells us the realities.
I hope you are able to get a good instrument; good luck.
You will probably not find all of the HP numbers I have listed on ebay; the HP805A, for instance, is a slotted line and they are rare today as is my HP7034A analog plotter My cute little HP354A attenuator is very rare .
These sites;
http://www.hparchive.com/
http://www.hpmemory.org/
http://www.kennethkuhn.com/hpmuseum/
are great reading for the aficionado of HP's years of greatness.
Kerry VK2TIL.7866 2012-10-13 21:42:57 Kerry Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
It works very well and agrees almost exactly with my Fluke 73.
I was wrong about the display; it's just normal red 7-segment LEDs. I was thinking of a Schlumberger counter that I have when I referred to the "dot-type" LEDs.
It has a NiCad pack inside; the 3466 has this too. The one in my instrument was in a very bad way; most cells had leaked and there was a fair bit of white crystalline powder around and a few small corrosions on the PCB.
I cleaned-up with isopropanol but didn't go further with cleaning; it should be OK.
If buying one it would be a good idea to check the batteries; there would be little hope of the batteries being useable but a check for corrosion would be advisable.
(I have a Ballantine 323 AC voltmeter that stopped working one day; when I investigated I found that much of the power supply PCB was corroded beyond repair. It was ex-Australian Navy so perhaps it had been in a salty environment).
I have put the 3465A on the bench for the present but I suspect that it will eventually go back to the store; the convenience of the Flukes, with auto-ranging and long-life battery operation, will probably win-out.
Kerry VK2TIL.7867 2012-10-14 10:01:03 kb1gmx Re: Some advice on used HP instrument. 7868 2012-10-14 14:30:45 Kerry Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
Vinegar swabbed on with a cotton bud and flushed off with isopropanol.
I didn't want to get into major dismantling but I was able to get-at the relevant spots quite easily.
There were only a couple of light spots on the main PCB; the PCB that carries the battery was a bit worse but there will be no battery now so it's not important.
Yes; age conquers all in the end. That's why most of my old HP etc stuff is in the store (I can't bring myself to throw it out, it's too nice) and modern stuff, small, light and efficient, is on the bench now.
There are still a few boat-anchors in use though; two HP variable DC supplies and a beautiful 5345A counter (one of the best instruments HP ever made I think).
Kerry VK2TIL.7872 2012-10-15 15:10:33 kb1gmx Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
I have a 4191A 1ghz Impedance analyzer and 8568B Spectrum Analyzer with options. Can't beat them with a sick as the stick would break.
Can't lift them either but, don't need to. Now a 8753A would be handy.
HP made a lot of gear that is worth getting and using.
Allison
7873 2012-10-15 16:01:09 Kerry Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
Try a HP141T spectrum analyser system (I have two); about 75 pounds I think.
My Marconi TF144H (my first "real" signal generator) weighs about the same.
Kerry VK2TIL.7874 2012-10-16 00:47:57 Lasse Moell Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
Not sure if you can upgrade the CRT to LCD like they do on the 8566/8....
BTW I ended up with a "spare" s-parameter test set (I did not have to send it back with the A-E swap), with the intention to do something fun with it. Still collecting dust though :)
/Lasse SM5GLC
On 16 okt 2012 00:10 "kb1gmx" <kb1gmx@arrl.net> wrote:
>
>
> Hi,
>
> I have a 4191A 1ghz Impedance analyzer and 8568B Spectrum Analyzer
> with options. Can't beat them with a sick as the stick would break.
> Can't lift them either but, don't need to. Now a 8753A would be handy.
>
> HP made a lot of gear that is worth getting and using.
>
> Allison
>7880 2012-10-17 16:09:01 kb1gmx Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
For those that need more light it has a RGB output and many color monitors can be attached with no problems.
I don't consider the CRT an issue enough to not have one, I just would not pay a lot for it. However it's an otherwise excellent instrument.
Allison
7915 2012-11-06 08:06:52 bobtbobbo Re: Some advice on used HP instrument. 7921 2012-11-07 22:15:36 ac2gl Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
Dave - AC2GL
7923 2012-11-08 05:28:16 bobtbobbo Re: Some advice on used HP instrument.
Bob